Birth Certificate

So I'm sure everyone has heard the news by now, right? Earlier today President Obama released a certified copy of his long form birth certificate from the state of Hawaii. As far as any credible sources are able to tell, this is the real deal, unlike the pathetic forgery of the original "certification of live birth" that was circulated before which then gave rise to the "birther" movement.

Follow along after the jump. ( U happy Dwip? :P )

Here's a full size copy of the file:

(cropped off the excess green at the top & bottom)

On the off chance one may not know the significance of why many of us spent so much time pursuing this, up to and including court cases, here's why:
US Constitution - Article II, Clause 5 said:

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

It may not seem like much, but the founding fathers included that clause in the Constitution to prevent the possibility of the presidency being usurped by a foreign power through the usual election process. The only way we have in which to verify something like this using official records is to see someone's long form birth certificate that lists the name of the delivering doctor, the names of the parents, and the name of the child, along with the location of the hospital.

Instead of simply complying with what should be a matter of routine, Obama instead supplied Congress with a similar document called a "certification of live birth" commonly known as the short form. It wasn't long before it was proven to be a forgery which led to the inception of a movement now called the "birther movement" in which several people filed suit to force Obama to disclose the long form. This began well before he actually won the primaries back in early 2008. It had been hoped at the time that it would all get heard in court and resolved before November of 2008. Needless to say, that didn't happen, and it led to all sorts of wild speculation. Speculation Obama himself deliberately fueled by blocking all attempts to access the document and spending millions of taxpayer dollars defending the lawsuits - each time getting them thrown out for lack of standing.

That only further inflamed things by prompting many people, myself included, to ask a simple question: Who the hell has standing?

We never got an answer to that from anyone. After Kerchner v Obama died reaching the Supreme Court, the issue subsided for awhile and one is led to assume Obama thought he dodged the bullet.

The entire reason the "birther movement" kept at it was because if the people affected by the election of a usurper president don't have standing, then who enforces the articles of the Constitution? What about other articles that presidents might not like? Who would have standing in those cases? It's a very serious issue that was being cast in the media as nothing more than a raving conspiracy theory. One in which it was claimed that Obama's family plotted some 50 years ago to sneak their son into the country, get him declared a citizen, and groom him to one day assume control of the presidency. Your typical left wing media treatment of anyone who believes in what our founders gave us and who isn't afraid to stand up for it. Like Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh. While neither of them was ever outspoken about the case, they both mentioned it from time to time and were instantly demonized for it. Way to treat people who love their country.

Enter Donald Trump. The man who singlehandedly brought this whole issue to an end. After it became clear he is considering a run for the presidency in 2012, he brought up the issue of the certificate. Naturally for doing so he was cast as just another raving lunatic. The press hoped the label would stick and he'd shut up and go away. Trump doesn't play that game. He threw it back in their faces and forced the issue back into the mainstream where it belonged. I have no doubt Trump would have forced Obama to disclose the certificate one way or the other. Either the controlled way they did today, or by filing suit in court once the election campaign was underway. Surely your opponent in an election has standing to sue? Trump has enough money to make that threat a reality.

So the birth certificate did exist, and it does have the expected information. As far as I'm concerned, the matter is now closed and we can move on to solving the real issues of our time. Ironically, Obama may find that with this behind him, his policy decisions will resurface and people will remember why he really does suck as a president.

BTW, I'm sure I need not say it, but there's already hardcore ACTUAL conspiracy theory sites out there claiming the long form is a forgery. One with a potentially convincing deconstruction of the document in Adobe Illustrator. Unless what they find turns into something I'm right there with everyone else in calling them wackos for now.
"It is pointless to resist, my son." -- Darth Vader
"Resistance is futile." -- The Borg
"Mother's coming for me in the dragon ships. I don't like these itchy clothes, but I have to wear them or it frightens the fish." -- Thurindil

Well. I guess that's that then.

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Posted on Apr 27, 2011 11:11 pm by Samson in: | 48 comment(s) [Closed]
Oh, hey, apparently the Whitehouse was even kind enough to provide the PDF.

Anyone here know Illustrator, have a copy, and could do what this weirdo is talking about?

Edited by Samson on Apr 27, 2011 11:22 pm
Samson said:

( U happy Dwip? )

Yes, I am in fact happy now.

...well, mostly. Your refusal to use the word "you" like a normal person saddens me greatly.

Anonymous [Anon] said:
Comment #3 Apr 28, 2011 12:19 am
Anyone who is doubting that this is edited is not very familiar with Photoshop. Ask any graphic designer etc... And they will tell you this edited in layers....and poorly at that.

Anonymous [Anon] said:
Comment #4 Apr 28, 2011 12:48 am
I agree with the above anonymous poster.

First, I'm a well-schooled and professional graphic artist, and have been for decades. I voted for Obama, am a democrat and am not considered anything even remotely close to a "birther." I thought all of this birth certificate bunk was hogwash, but now I'm not so sure.

Not only is it plausible that this birth certificate was somehow modified from the original, it's the only explanation. You cannot, I repeat, cannot create a PDF from a scanned image and have it automagically break down into separate, distinct components--complete with alpha channels no less. It's impossible. As in, absolutely, utterly impossible.

The ONLY way this could happen is if it is constructed in a desktop publishing solution, and then a PDF is created from that. Why they would have done this will remain a mystery, I'm sure, but you can bet your life that that's just how it happened.

Anonymous [Anon] said:
Comment #5 Apr 28, 2011 4:06 am
Does this mean that if, in theory, I would emigrated to USA, got citizenship and if I would have political aspirations, I couldn't become the president of the USA? I think I understood it correctly.

How far in the politics can such citizen go? Up to governor of a state? Like Conan the Terminator in California... :)

3 anon trolls LOL.

Gotta love 'em.

Is it possible that they are all the same person.

And for Obama; would it have really been to much for you to bring this out earlier? A third of your country came to believe that the Bush administration was behind 9/11 so its no surprise that a third of America's population might come to believe that you were born in Kenya.

Anonymous [Anon] said:
Comment #9 Apr 28, 2011 7:18 am
Hi The_Fury, Dwip, and prettyfly.
3rd "anon troll" here. No, I'm not the same person as first two. I just followed the link from Bethesda Forums, read the article, got interested and posted a normal question which I consider less trolling than your respective comments.
Thank you for being so 'nice', I can find out the answer elsewhere (not that I have desire to become president of anything except maybe Zenimax:)). Bye.

Vladaar [Anon] said:
Comment #10 Apr 28, 2011 7:48 am
Forged fake, right Trump! I still say he was born in Kenya and is a Muslim. Why else work so hard to destroy America?

Looks like it was run through a text recognition program when it was digitised. The program broke it down into borders and illegable characters, main text, and then date stamps. It's probably designed to recognise the last so the repository can be searched.

It's also a composite which has been edited prior to release, possibly because anothor certificate is directly beneath Obama's. So it is a "fake" in the sense that it is not the original paper copy, but it should be taken as a genuine copy of the original record; but then that was exactly what the short copy was as well.

prettyfly said:

Is it possible that they are all the same person.

Three different people. I wasn't aware this place is being followed that closely :P

Regarding the Photoshop/Illustrator claims, apparently that's just how the software rolls. After seeing the claims made at that conspiracy website, I asked someone I know who does Illustrator and Photoshop work for a living what she thinks. What these guys are seeing is normal behavior of the program when importing any PDF file, regardless of where it came from. It's part of what it does during the OCR phase or something. I didn't quite understand it all, not being familiar with either program.

3rd Anon said:

Does this mean that if, in theory, I would emigrated to USA, got citizenship and if I would have political aspirations, I couldn't become the president of the USA?

Yes, that's exactly what it means, because our Constitution requires that you be a natural born citizen in order to be elected president. You can however get elected to local office, state office, and even to the Senate or the House though without meeting that requirement.

Sigurd said:

Looks like it was run through a text recognition program when it was digitised.

Romping through Google more or less confirms this. Hawaii digitized all their birth records in 2001.

That said, it was already well established that for whatever stupid ass reason the short form *WAS* a forgery. That's what makes all this so incredibly stupid now that the real long form is out there. Waste time forging a short form, then spending millions to keep the long form out of play, and for what? There's nothing on the long form that's the least bit damning. It's surely a facepalm worthy situation.

Edited by Samson on Apr 28, 2011 12:23 pm
Anonymous [Anon] said:
Comment #13 Apr 28, 2011 12:41 pm
If the short form was a forgery, but contained the same information as the long form, why would the long form be genuine? It makes no sense. They're either both genuine or both forgeries. Any other explanation does not pass Occam's razor.

Because the short form was genuine; someone just made up a story and people believed it. That being said, Anonymous #4 might be missing a key component of Occam's razor: If there are two or more explanations of (a given thing), the simplest one is to be preferred unless there is evidence to suggest otherwise.

Yes, and again, as stupid as it may seem, they did indeed prove the short form to be a forged document. It makes zero sense but that's the plain truth of it. Document analysis of the short form was conclusive and the only people who still maintain it wasn't forged just refuse to accept it.

Doesn't much matter now though, does it? Long form is out, the anomalies found with the PDF appear to be par for the course with the shitty way the digitized records are stored, and the shitty way programs like Illustrator handle them.

If it's not good enough at this point then the only way to prove it to anyone's satisfaction is the invention of time travel.

My understanding was that the short form was just a digital copy made up when Obama lost his original, it's not a "fake" any more than a typed-up version from the pre-photocopy era produced by a Clerk in the Health Department. It's an offical document certified by the Hawaii Health Dept., who have access to the original register.

That's what the short form was supposed to be, but the one we were shown in public was proven a forgery which is why the media rarely mentions it anymore. Corroborated by plenty of other people who were born in Hawaii and were able to get copied of their short forms that looked nothing like what Obama's supposedly did.

Wiki says no, people have seen the hardcopy. The "media" mentions it plenty - too. It obviously wasn't a forgery because it agress with the long form.

I can understand your concern over your Constitutional situation, but this has always been a non starter. There was no reason for the rumor to begin with.

It's Wikipedia, you can't seriously expect any trust to be placed in an organization that not even left wing liberal universities will accept as a valid source for something?

I don't even know why it matters now. Short form was forged. Long form appears to be standing up to forensic scrutiny. Issue resolved. Why the fuck are we still going on about it?

Unless you want to enter in to a discussion of Obama's character and his pattern of lies, then by all means...

No, why do people say the Short Form of was forged? Obama could get a genuine one with exactly the same information on it, so why forge it. Far more likely it was genuine, issued after 2001. In one of the articles Dwip posted a journalist said a coleague of his got her Short Certificate and it was the same.

Wikipedia links to other sites. What evidence is there that the Short Form was forged. The State officials say it is genuine.

The state officials also said Obama didn't have a long form. If we go by what they say, they're playing opposite day or something.

People say the short form was forged because it was forensically deconstructed and proven to be a forgery. That's why the whole issue blew itself up into what it became. Forged documents, stonewalling legitimate requests, spending millions to shoot down legitimate lawsuits, what the hell else were people supposed to think?

People say the short form was forged because it was forensically deconstructed and proven to be a forgery.
By who?
stonewalling legitimate requests
What government authority ever made such a request? What non-government authority ever made such a request, and where did they get the authority to make said request? (Random asshat with a radio show doesn't count.)
spending millions to shoot down legitimate lawsuits,
Who were the plaintiffs in these alleged lawsuits? What branch of the government was prosecuting this case?
what the hell else were people supposed to think?
They're supposed to think that the letter of the law had been fulfilled before Mr.Obama won the Democrat nomination and anyone that thinks otherwise is either retarded, a liar, or desperate.

Try reading the wiki article, it offers a good rundown as I remember things. So far as I know no one has proved anything. It's just a bunch of groundless assertions. The Hawaii State officials have said the Short Form is genuine, one minor official seems to have dropped the ball once and misspoke, but for the last two years they have maintained that the long form existed in hard copy

By who?

Look it up. Easy enough to find through Google. Ya'll always pull this, expecting me to do your research for you. No wonder people just accept what they're told without questioning it.

What government authority ever made such a request?

Congress, when he had to file papers to certify. McCain complied, Obama did not, but the Dems covered for him and Pelosi herself even said it was nobody's business how he went about that. Second government body: We the People. Perhaps you've heard of us? Random asshat with a radio show was merely the voice the people chose to raise the alarm.

Who were the plaintiffs in these alleged lawsuits?

You really do live in a hole, don't you? I've even discussed one particular case right here on my own blog!

They're supposed to think that the letter of the law had been fulfilled

In a perfect world, that would happen. This isn't a perfect world. Issues were raised, concerns aired, Pelosi and Reid immediately moved to calling us birthers and conspiracy theorists without ever doing anything to prove there wasn't a problem. Once the suspicion was up, the lawsuits began. When the courts repeatedly dismissed the cases without ever hearing the facts of the matters, shit got real and it wasn't ever going to go away.

Clearly it hasn't yet because we're still here talking about it despite Obama finally doing what he should have done to begin with.

@Sigurd: Wiki articles on political matters are utter crap. Everyone knows this. They have a huge liberal bias there. It isn't worth the time trying to read through sanitized propaganda.

That one person you're referring to was the only person who spoke the truth, and they got slapped down pretty hard for it because it very nearly blew the whole thing wide open.

It boils down to this. It's obvious as hell this was a legit issue, Trump was in the right to keep bringing it up, and Obama's legal guys knew Trump's lawyers wouldn't stand for the bullshit argument of not having standing to bring suit. That's why he finally just gave up and revealed it. You know damn good and well his team has been using it as a political football for the last 3 years because the media loves this shit.

By who?

Look it up. Easy enough to find through Google.

Fair enough question and one that i would also like an answer to, burden is on you to demonstrate that it is forged and that it was proven by a court of law and that the people who undertook the forensics are in fact a real lab that is authorized to present forensic evidence in the USA.

People say the short form was forged because it was forensically deconstructed and proven to be a forgery

What people and do these people have the standing to be able to make such a judgment. Remember my torture evidence, now you need to play by your own rules here too, either you submit evidence of proof to the same standard as you hold us to, or you can admit that it was not forged and it was all bullshit to begin with. No cake and eat it today.

Edited by The_Fury on Apr 29, 2011 1:26 am
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